6502.org

I'm using Topwin 6.12. I haven't tried to program a 22V10 as yet, but soon will.

For those who are interested, the most recent version of the TopWin burner software can be found at http://www.top2048.com/gb/tops/topwin6.exe.

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The above link is no longer valid.

I finally got my website updated. You can find information concerning DEC-1 and the Wait-State Generator I recently completed under the

Programmable Logic section.

Daryl

Hi thought I would add this here for those struggling with the TOP20xx Programmers and being the above URL is no longer active..

This is The home TOP website in China ..

http://www.topwin6.com/

Drop this URL into Google and when it shows the direct link click translate , Unless you want to learn Chinese..

Before you Buy one of these on EBAY check this site, Many versions of the burner are no longer supported including many sold as new on EBAY

Current software version as of 9/2011 is v6.32.. Many Models have been abandon as of 4/2011 and will only work with v6.30 as follows

Top853, Top2005, Top2007, Top2009, Top2049...

Top2004 was abandon 12/2008 and can only run v3.5

Every Version of the software is listed and what version of Windows it supports, And what versions of the programmer it supports, And those no longer supported, And the final version of the software that supports each different model.. All software versions are available for download..

There seems to be problems with uninstalling old drivers.. leftover ini files and registry remnants.. If you know how clean this stuff from your comp do it otherwise select a different install directory during install will help mitigate some problems..

To Update.. Unplug Programmer from system,, Scan the new drivers for VIRUS,, Uninstall prior Drivers,, Download an run CCleaner and also do a registry scan with it,, And remove anything related to TopWin,, Turn off anti-virus,, Install New Drivers in a different directory than the prior version by Right clicking the install file and click INSTALL AS ADMINISTRATOR!!!!! Especially Win7 & Vista..

Turn anti-virus back on and Scan just to be sure,, Reboot System,, Plug in Programmer,, Found new device pops up,, Select no to find driver on Web,, Select Automatic when asked,, When Install finishes LED on programmer should turn green and your good to go.. ROTS OF RUCK

NOTE: 27 Series Eprom's draw in excess of 500ma during programming which exceeds most laptop USB current limits and some desktop computers,, A external power supply must be used or the programming will fail.. Other higher current draw chips may also fail if your attached to a anemic USB port ,, Don't know if Programmer will work from a powered hub some devices just will not work with them... Please Post if you have run the Programmer on a powered hub and were successful..

Most of you know this stuff,, But there's always someone who doesn't or forgets the run as admin step..

I have decided to stop wasting my time with these junky Chinese programmers and get one that actually does what it is claimed to do. As always, you never get more than what you pay for. In the case of the TOPS programmers, that isn't much.

Do you have a constructive recommendation?

Sure. Take a look at this unit. A colleague of mine acquired one earlier this year and is quite satisfied with it. Both Mouser and Digi-Key carry it, or you can buy it direct.

Yea Great If I had 500+ to spend, but living off $1500 a month social security does not permit such ventures.. But if I had the money I would file 13 this thing myself..

For those of us who one way or another ended up owning one of these turkeys, The idea is to get it to function and what use is possible from them..

The device itself is fairly well designed, But the software is horrid.. And Pillips never supported the PDIUSB12 (USB to Parallel chip) that interfaces with the 8051 clone MCU that runs this thing, And its not a true usb protocol and not HID compliant.. So the drivers have to do tricks to make it work in various operating systems.. If you install the wrong drivers and then try to uninstall the program.. When you install the right program it will not run.. You will find its still trying to run the drivers from the prior install.. After a uninstall you have to find and delete every copy of windrv, windrv6 both sys & ini found anywhere in Windows/System32, Including driver cache, After that CCleaner reg scan will find any reg entry's pointing to the file locations and you can delete them from your registry.. Its the phillips usb drivers that cause the problems .. On the new versions of the software it uninstalls using a restore point, Which can cause its own basket of worms.. Or you get the option of using the standard uninstall neither works very well.. The drivers and the program should be separate install but they did not give us that option..

Second the Top20xx Programmers are very power hungry exceeding most USB port capabilities.. I pluged this thing into my dell studio and it instantly shut down the computer,, 500ma max MY ASS,, This thing should have at-least a one amp or more power source.. I suspect allot of programming failures are caused by insufficiency power to the unit.. I have been looking at USB power injector circuits similar to the one on this website.
http://www.extremecircuits.net/2010/03/ ... -hard.html

As I said on the prior post a well powered hub may work but many devices will not work with them.. Also being this uses a less than standard USB protocol its more than likely to cause more problems than it fixes..
But that will vary depending on the brand,, One brand hub may work another may not.. So If anyone finds one that works please post the brand and model number..

Another option is just cracking the unit open, Cut the usb power trace and install a LM1084IT-5 5amp reg inside and adding a power jack,, A bit overkill but their cheap and at a 5 amp rating they are less likely to overheat without a heatsink.. You could add a mosfet and use the USB 5v to turn the turn the external power on and off as it does in the power injector circuit link above..

Thanks!
This too seems like a very positive way to proceed!

Injecting power to the USB cable sounds like a good plan - the strands inside a USB cable are standard colours so you needn't even open the unit, just sacrifice a cable.

Cheers
Ed

I just ordered two different USB Hubs on Ebay one 4 port unit that claims 1 amp per port but not over 2.5 amps for all ports, cost $4.84 And a second passive four port for $2.75 that I will disassemble and make into a single port power injector and 3 usb power only ports for USB rechargeable devices.. I'll let you know how it turns out..

My studio 1737 is Vista but I won't try running it again there till I get the powered hub or the power injector built..

Right now I have three differet versions of the software installed on My old XP tower computer.. v3.5, v5.99 and v6.32s in separate directory's top-1, top-2, top-3.. They were installed oldest to newest to see if the next version disabled the one before it ... It did not.. As I start anyone of them it asks to reinstall the driver so I do so..

v3.5 continues to run perfect v5.99 gives (EAccess Violation Error) Also note here that v3.5 & v5.99 use exactly the same drivers so in this case the problem is somewhere else in the software,, The Next one v6.32s fails to find the programmer.. NOTE here I downloaded v6.30 which is the last version that top2005 will supposedly work on, But when I installed it, v6.32s is displayed which is not top2005 compatible according to their website.. But the difference may be in DLL's or some other support files,, Or someone may have screwed up and labeled the file wrong.. I'm still researching it.. There is supposedly a ver4 out there but cannot find it..

Addendum, Added v5.69 in a directory Top-3 it also uses the same drivers as v3.5 & v5.99 It runs and appears to be functioning normally.. but when you select the chip it displays it on the screen, But when you try to read the chip it says no chip selected..

Also Note that each version of the software behaves exactly the same as it did when I had it install one at a time in their recommended directory..

I am also beginning to believe some problems may be due to what brand USB controller is in your computer (NEC,Nvida,VIA,Intel) ect.... After the power injector is done I will install It in all 4 of my computers and see If I get different results and note the USB chip involved

I have read on other sites that these things work great in china and fail here due to chinese characters left in code and config files during translation to English.. Lots of Ideas why they don't work but no solid fixes yet..

NOTE: Please do not take this as gospel as I'm still trying to root out the cause of these failures... And some of my assumption could be wrong at this point..

Yes, I agree the price is up there. However, I use a burner for more than hobby purposes, ergo I need something that will perform as advertised (which the TOP units don't do) and not be saddled with buggy software. As I earlier said, you get what you pay for.

Not to mention lousy product quality control.

I had to replace the ZIF socket in my TOP853 after about 18 months of usage. I had been experiencing random failures during burning sessions and eventually discovered that two pins weren't always making contact when the socket was closed. As you can probably surmise, this was not a trivial repair to make. Aside from having to extract the bad socket from the PCB without wrecking everything, it was necessary to enlarge the cutout in the top cover to fit the slightly wider replacement (and much more rugged) socket.

Earlier I had made a comment about "junky Chinese programmers." This socket debacle was but one of countless examples that I have encountered ever since "Made in USA", "Made in Japan" and "Made in Taiwan" were replaced by "Made in China." Back in the 1960s when "Made in Japan" was synonymous with junk, the Japanese wasted little time rectifying the situation. Ditto for the Taiwanese companies, who went through a similar cycle. Unlike Japan and Taiwan, China doesn't have a free market economy that forces continuous improvement in products and services. Also, they don't have watchdog groups to sound the alarm when a questionable product is discovered. Predictably, the result is a steady output of sometimes-dangerous junk.

Unlike another member around here who is the self-appointed thought police and took exception to my "junky Chinese" phrase, I do not feel compelled to engage in political correctness and will not mince words when I encountered shoddy products. There's a reason why these TOP burners are cheap, and it isn't due to magnanimous feelings on the part of the manufacturer.

As for powering the unit, it shouldn't be all that difficult to modify one of these devices so it can be hooked up to a wall-wart.

I agree totally this thing is junk

This is what I gleaned so far

1 Socket fails..
2 Socket appears to fail but really the programmers buss driving transistors overheated.... Circuit board is covered. with them..
3 USB power insufficient causing communication problems..
4 Power sufficient causes overheating...
5 Chip library only support one voltage setting for chip to be programmed and some require reduced vdd during the write function..
Its a safety mechanism to prevent accidental writes during normal operation... If you edit the library for the 4 volt vdd you can write but then you can't read it and the verify will fail..
6 Chip Library wrong for some chips, Powering 3.3v chips with 5v..
7 USB chip in programmer unsupported and non standard protocol requiring workarounds.. Weather it works or not dependent on your computers USB port chip and how well they wrote the workaround for it..
8 Chinese to English translation left bugs in software..
9 Manufacturer could give a dam if it works or not.. Zero Support , No Email Address..
10 One guy claimed he could only program a particular chip if he put it in the freezer for 20 minutes before programming it..
11 If software left with verify window open it causes a high current draw will overheat unit and it will stop working..
12 Software Update swaps one set of problems for a new set of problems.. A chip that wouldn't work before now programs and one that worked before no longer works...
13 Some have found smoked driver transistors were causing some chips not to program,, Article was referring to GAL's

What a Gem this thing is............ A $20 PIC32 could probably program 40 eproms at a time without breaking a sweat.. And be fully plug and play compliant

On the other hand this new version of the Willem has come to market... They finally decided to abandon the parallel port ((True USB Willem ECU EPROM BIOS SPI universal Programmer)) But of course it is also made in china...

Sure the TOP 853 is cheap and undoubtedly nasty, but I just want to add a bit of balance to the discussion by saying it worked fine for me. I'm only an occasional user (in fact, so far I have used it three times) so I don't want to shell out too much money for these things. I'm happy with it so far.
I think the device's manufacturing place of origin shouldn't really be an issue. I mean, come on, all of Apple's inventory is made in China and that is some of the best put together kit I have ever encountered.

This is my point too - I found BDD's comment offensively specific. It would have been fine to say that he doesn't like to buy junk, but always better to recommend something which isn't junk, because a constructive comment is always preferable.

Cheers
Ed