Giving the C64 a WiFi Modem

[BigEd]

Indeed, it's clear that the Pi is very useful! They've sold many millions, about a third each to education, to industry, and to hobbyists.

There remains the question, for each of us, what use is a Pi, and it may be that those of us already in possession of a working POC machine can already do everything we want to... ...and then there's the rest of us.

For those who like old-school programming, I'd recommend booting into RISC OS Pico - it's a command-line BBC Basic environment, with built-in assembler of course, booting instantly and with no configuration. The full-sized RISC OS is a GUI environment with network stack, web browser, and all the usual tools, including BBC Basic again.

For those who like to know a machine completely, there are several bare-metal tutorials and projects, and writing your own OS is practical if you have the time and inclination. The PiTubeDirect is an extraordinary example of a bare metal project. I've had the honour of being a small part of that team.

Mostly, I'm sure, you'd find a Pi will be running Linux - often as a media server.

The only somewhat awkward thing about the Pi is that there are now several models, and you have to make a choice. Oh, and the fact that the I/O is 3V3, and not 5V tolerant.

[KC9UDX]

I have several. One that runs OSMC and is connected to a TV for media purposes. It also has a Raspbian installation for when I file my taxes (just done). It's a constant source of aggravation though, because every time I let it do an automatic update, for reasons that confound me, every time, the circuit breaker for that branch circuit mysteriously trips, hosing both the OSMC and Raspbian installs. This happened again just yesterday. OSMC will only give a sad face, and Raspbian has reverted to some default network settings. Every time l correct the network settings, they revert on boot. I'm faced with having to reinstall both from scratch, again.

One is dedicated for the PiDP-8 which I haven't found time nor ambition to assemble, and might never.

One is going to be a file server, to replace the various machines that I've used for that in the past. It will store any files that I might need long term for use on any of the other computers I have.

[KC9UDX]

My biggest gripe with the Pi is that the free software is very expensive if you don't have unlimited internet already.

A single update on any of the official OSs can use up an entire month's data for me
Installing an OS is a major undertaking.

[BigEd]

Oh yes, any kind of data charge makes a huge difference these days!

[GARTHWILSON]

I have DSL with unlimited data. $20 a month.

We've gotten way off topic, but it probably doesn't matter since I'm not sure there's much more to discuss on a C64 WiFi modem anyway. I just wanted to expose the fact that it's available.

[BigEd]

The other retro-related wifi-related gizmo I've seen is a wifi-enabled SD Card, which allows a solid state storage solution to be updated over the LAN.

[KC9UDX]

GARTHWILSON wrote:

I have DSL with unlimited data. $20 a month.

Every year or so, I price it out. The cheapest I can find is about $130/month.

Sure, I can get internet for only $20/month too, but I'd be required to "bundle" with $110 worth of other services which I don't want. Right now, for around $20 I get around 2Gb of data.

Big Ed wrote:

The other retro-related wifi-related gizmo I've seen is a wifi-enabled SD Card, which allows a solid state storage solution to be updated over the LAN.

That's interesting! Do you know what it's called?

[BigEd]

Two cards I just found: Eyefi Mobi Pro, and Transcend's Wi-Fi SD card. What I didn't say, and perhaps should have, is that first you need a solid state storage solution which uses SD cards, and then you buy a commercial Wifi-enabled SD Card.

[GARTHWILSON]

KC9UDX wrote:

GARTHWILSON wrote:

I have DSL with unlimited data. $20 a month.

Every year or so, I price it out. The cheapest I can find is about $130/month.

Sure, I can get internet for only $20/month too, but I'd be required to "bundle" with $110 worth of other services which I don't want. Right now, for around $20 I get around 2Gb of data.

I have DSL Extreme: https://www.dslextreme.com/dsl/residential If you have a land line, you can add DSL for as little as little as $13/mo, unlimited data. We don't have, or want, any TV service. Our land line costs something like $30/mo. I mostly use the land line phone on my desk. I carry a cell phone when I go out, mainly only for emergencies, and I sometimes go a month at a time without even turning it on. My website was hosted on our son's server computer here at home (on the DSL) for the first couple of years (2012-2014). He still hosts a couple of others that get very little traffic, but mine is on a virtual server in NY that can dish up 100Mbps or more so visitors aren't kept waiting when there are lots at a time downloading pages.

[whartung]

KC9UDX wrote:

Sure, I can get internet for only $20/month too, but I'd be required to "bundle" with $110 worth of other services which I don't want. Right now, for around $20 I get around 2Gb of data.

Couple of thoughts here.

First, of course, theres ye old 'free wifi' at Starbucks -- that may be a solution. Or perhaps a public library.

But the other, is to get the source code, via whatever source code system they're using (Git, SVN, etc.), then when they release an update, you can "switch" to the new branch, and, ideally, just download the differential in terms of the source.

Then, of course, you have to build it your self, which may well be non-trivial.

But once you get it done the first time, you should be able to keep up to date much more cheaply at least in terms of bandwidth.

Finally, you may well be able to find a friend that you can send an SD card who will stuff the latest on to it and mail it back.

I hope to get an RPi in the next couple months.

[KC9UDX]

GARTHWILSON wrote:

I have DSL Extreme: https://www.dslextreme.com/dsl/residential

Not available here, and I don't know why. I won't ask them or they'll never stop pestering me.

Quote:

If you have a land line, you can add DSL for as little as little as $13/mo, unlimited data. We don't have, or want, any TV service. Our land line costs something like $30/mo.

I'd like to have a land line. I cancelled the one I had about seven years ago. Our state banned small phone companies from undercutting the big ones, and since then, a POTS line ("unbundled") is around $75/month.

I have multiple cell phones, because the service is free, and I usually buy the phones when they are on sale for $35. I rarerly ever actually use the phone, I typically use them for internet access, which is free to a point.

whartung wrote:

First, of course, theres ye old 'free wifi' at Starbucks -- that may be a solution. Or perhaps a public library.

But the other, is to get the source code, via whatever source code system they're using (Git, SVN, etc.), then when they release an update, you can "switch" to the new branch, and, ideally, just download the differential in terms of the source.

Then, of course, you have to build it your self, which may well be non-trivial.

But once you get it done the first time, you should be able to keep up to date much more cheaply at least in terms of bandwidth.

Finally, you may well be able to find a friend that you can send an SD card who will stuff the latest on to it and mail it back.

There are two routes I take now. One is the free public Wi-Fi. That is fine for small downloads, and questionable at best for large ones, like operating systems. I downloaded NetBSD6.x one time that way and it took over 6 hours, with multiple retries. Most places I go where there is free Wi-Fi seem to have elaborate throttling systems just to prevent this sort of thing.

The other is to buy CDs from an outfit online which I can't remember the name of. They sell CDs of install disks for free operating systems at the price of the media plus postage plus a little for their time. I've run into two issues. One is that the computer I have which can read CDs and DVDs will no longer work with the larger SD cards, and my current (foreseaable future) budget does not allow for me to purchase computer hardware (which may or may not actually work with the hardware I currently have, which is always another issue). The other issue is that I refuse to buy SD cards like that by mail anymore (even if I could afford to). I had two that went springing out of the envelope and into oblivion when I opened the packaging, on separate occasions. So I simply refuse to go down that road again.

Quote:

I hope to get an RPi in the next couple months.

I would highly recommend it. One of the problems I have with them is that every time I think I have enough of them, I find another use for one.

Take a lot of time figuring out what you want to buy. It's very easy to buy a prepackaged setup that is missing something you wish you'd bought. But, buying it separately usually means spending more than a different package with it would have cost. I have three different ones that came in three different packages. I wish I'd taken notes about what Iliked and disliked about them. Also be careful about packages that come with parts that don't actually work together. I have one that came with a 128Gb SD card, and think the Pi that was in the package only supports 32Gb. Another one came with a Wi'Fi adaptor that I just didn-t need because the Pi had built'in Wi'Fi. And for some reason that Wi'Fi adaptor only works in the Pis I have, not with desktop computers.

[whartung]

KC9UDX wrote:

GARTHWILSON wrote:

I have DSL Extreme: https://www.dslextreme.com/dsl/residential

Not available here, and I don't know why. I won't ask them or they'll never stop pestering me.

Comparing telecom plans across the country is pointless. It's like saying "Oh, you should get my cable plan", but they vary widely geographically.

KC9UDX wrote:

There are two routes I take now. One is the free public Wi-Fi. That is fine for small downloads, and questionable at best for large ones, like operating systems. I downloaded NetBSD6.x one time that way and it took over 6 hours, with multiple retries. Most places I go where there is free Wi-Fi seem to have elaborate throttling systems just to prevent this sort of thing.

Well, that's a feature of the BSDs. The OS and Userland are in a single source tree. Source for NetBSD is 500M compressed. So, in theory, once you have the baseline, you can CVS update to keep up to date cheaply

KC9UDX wrote:

The other is to buy CDs from an outfit online which I can't remember the name of.

Used to get our CDs from InfoMagic at Computer shows back in the days before ubiquitous internet.

KC9UDX wrote:

I would highly recommend it. One of the problems I have with them is that every time I think I have enough of them, I find another use for one.

Take a lot of time figuring out what you want to buy.

As soon as these come back in stock, I'm going to pull the trigger: https://www.adafruit.com/products/3058 Seems like a decent kit. I need to get an SDCard reader/writer for my Mac though, but that should get me started.

[KC9UDX]

Some things to consider:

Get a larger SD card, and make sure you're not in the boat I'm in where you can't get software on it. The 8G card is really limiting for these things in my opinion. It's too convenient to have multiple OSs installed, and each one wants a large amount of space. However, I'm also considering, since I'm tired of one OS apparently trashing the others, that it may make more sense to have each OS on its own SD card and swap them out like floppy disks... (Need to build a glovebox to avoid losing SD cards).

Make sure that the SD card reader you buy for your Mac actually works with the SD card you buy for the Pi, and that that card also works in the Pi. Also it helps if the card reader also works with the Pi and your choice of operating system.

Get a wireless keyboard/mouse of some sort. Wired keyboards are impractical because the Pi in its case is lighter than all the cords connected to it. One of the things I've considered is to build a heavy steel case for the Pi, or rigidly mount it, but that doesn't alleviate the ratsnest problem. Also, having a wireless or BlueTooth keyboard/mouse combination means one less of those precious USB sockets to use up. Don't be like me and think, "I've got plenty of keyboards and mouses lying round that I can use with it". RPis multiply, and you don't want to be sharing keyboards and mouses betwixt them!

osdisc.com was the place I couldn't remember the name of.

[Arlet]

Aslak3 wrote:

Truer words were seldom spoken. I "love" the Internet, but port 80 is a technical jungle full of huge snakes, the deepest pits ever dug by man, and landmines. The whole lot needs ripping up and starting again, but of course that'll never happen.

Probably for the better. Ripping up big complex projects and starting again tends to make even bigger messes.

[Tor]

If HTTP were to be re-invented I would be fine with just a single change: No user-agent string. That was a huge mistake. Everything would have been different without it.