Cheap PCB stories...

[Nightmaretony]

http://www.nightmarepark.com/6502/Pinba ... tuffed.jpg

20 made for prototypes, ultimatepcb.com. They messed up on the 2 logos on the upper right but the rest of the silkscreen and board appear ok.
my total cost including shipping was 420.

cost for 100 of them would be at 7.50 each, excluding setups and shipping from china.

the silkscreen issue gives me pause. I check my gerbers and they were fine.

am needing to learn CPLDs to program the main one, so I cant do electrical full testing until I get the central thing set up...

[GARTHWILSON]

Quote:

They messed up on the 2 logos on the upper right [...] the silkscreen issue gives me pause. I check my gerbers and they were fine.

I use Gerbv gerber-viewer software to see the completed gerbers, and take screenshots and include them with the files when I email, to help eliminate any doubt.  If you use Ubuntu Linux, it's available for one-click download and installation in the Ubuntu software center.  Edit, 12/1/16: I see there's a free 3D online gerber viewer at http://mayhewlabs.com/3dpcb .

[Nightmaretony]

windows xp over here, I will take screenshots for the next time round. I did and sent to them about the error.

[GARTHWILSON]

I probably should have mentioned (in case it wasn't obvious) that my reason for using the gerber viewer was so they couldn't pass the buck and blame my CAD.  If the independent gerber viewer software confirmed that the CAD output was what I wanted, it takes away any argument they might have against doing it again free if they messed up.  If I just took screenshots from the CAD itself, it would not pack the punch of proof.

[Nightmaretony]

from now on, will scrennshot all layers to add in with it....

[GARTHWILSON]

May not be a bad idea, but I usually just do a couple of combinations of layers to show key things, then they can see how they line up also.

[BillO]

Since my last post on this topic I have discovered a new supplier: http://www.sitopway.com

I do a lot of business with them. The previous guy's, while priced well, do not seem to be very responsive. They also do not do assembly or supply components.

In fact, these guy's are so good, I've begun to base my pricing on their quotes and charges. This now has me worried as I can't find an alternative supplier that can provide the same quality as the same price. Yikes! I'm just nervous having a sole source.

Anyway, they recently blew me away by providing a low volume prototype service on this:

The quote was for 5 units, all parts supplied and soldered (as you see it) and shipped to me in Canada was $158USD. That's just $31.60 a board! The picture is proof I went for it.

If you need either low, medium or high volume turnkey production, these guy's are great. Use them if you can and keep them in business for me.

[BigDumbDinosaur]

BillO wrote:

Since my last post on this topic I have discovered a new supplier: http://www.sitopway.com...Anyway, they recently blew me away by providing a low volume prototype service on this:

OMS AVD ABU.jpg

Cool! And in red, no less. What does this device do?

[BillO]

BigDumbDinosaur wrote:

Cool! And in red, no less. What does this device do?

The full explanation would take several pages, but in the end it's a simple microcontroller development board for use with ATmegaXX8 MCUs. It was commissioned by a university that wanted something the students would be interested in and to teach the concepts of modular (repeatable, rapid and reliable) design. So to achieve that goal, it is compatible with Arduino shields and with 3-wire modules. The ZIF socket is there so that the students need only buy an MCU or two for their needs and the university will have a bunch of the boards around for the students to share. The student can use a ATmega328 with an Arduino bootloader on it and use the Arduino IDE, or if they wish, it has a standard ICSP header if they want to use a different software platform. Apparently though, all the students are Arduino nuts.

This is a prototype. Several changes have been made for the production model (due in 2 weeks) that add functionality and increase versatility, which was a key concern for the university.

The red color was specified by the client. The university thought it would be easier to detect students palming them and hence somewhat abate attrition. I suggested they go with yellow, as I felt no one would want one.

[BigDumbDinosaur]

BillO wrote:

BigDumbDinosaur wrote:

Cool! And in red, no less. What does this device do?

The full explanation would take several pages...The red color was specified by the client. The university thought it would be easier to detect students palming them and hence somewhat abate attrition. I suggested they go with yellow, as I felt no one would want one.

Since the PCB is Canadian Red, perhaps you should include a maple leaf in the artwork right next to "Engineered in Canada." Dunno if that's even possible but it would be really ultracool!

[BillO]

BigDumbDinosaur wrote:

Since the PCB is Canadian Red, perhaps you should include a maple leaf in the artwork right next to "Engineered in Canada." Dunno if that's even possible but it would be really ultracool!

I guess I could create a custom pattern in the shape of a flag. Sounds like a cool idea. Thanks!

[Aslak3]

The topic of PCB makers came up in the Hardware forum, so I wanted to share my thoughts.

I've used Botechcircuis (http://www.botechcircuits.com/). The website is complete rubbish, however they are very good and I would recommend them. It's a small Chinese firm, and I'm guessing nearly all the business comes through ebay, eg:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/170919488688

Prices are $30 for 10 of 10cm x 10cm dual layer board, tolerances down to 6mil. $20 for DHL international shipping. 4 layer boards (which I've not used myself) are $89 at the same size. The boards seem to be of good quality, and of course, if you need less boards but bigger boards, the price goes up more slowly. eg. 5 of 142mm x 125mm was $55 + $20 shipping for me back in Arpil. Turn around time, though I don't have much to compare it with, is excellent. They take gerber files, and possibly other nonstandard formats as well.

[GARTHWILSON]

Some here have undoubtedly seen Moosfet's forum post by now, about an EEPROM programmer.  His web page on it has a link to http://www.dirtypcbs.com/ with ultra cheap boards.  I wonder how their quality is.  They have a lot of stock ones too (obviously someone else's custom boards), and a few are quite interesting, including:

• this SMT-to-DIP adapter set
• this board and this board to drive a parallel-interface intelligent LCD module with 65c22 serial (using a 74HC595 shift register)
• this board to drive a parallel-interface intelligent LCD module from I²C, using the MCP23017 I²C port expander
• this C64 expansion port adapter
• this TQFP44-to-DIP adapter
• this LQFP48-to-DIP adapter
• this SSOP24-to-DIP (skinny) adapter

It looks like they hold the price down ultra low in hopes of selling more of your custom board to others who might decide it suits their need too.  It would probably be good to do a point-to-point and dimensional check on them before using them, in case the originator had an error that the board house doesn't know about.  They take a long time, don't read readme files, have exacting requirements for file extensions, don't allow holes under .012", and are not nice about helping you through problems (because they're not making enough money to give it any human attention) (I can't imagine this one worked out very well), but if you can put up with all that, you get a really inexpensive board, as little as $14 for 10 smallish 2-layer boards.  They also offer 4-, 6-, and 8-layer boards.

[BitWise]

GARTHWILSON wrote:

Some here have undoubtedly seen Moosfet's forum post by now, about an EEPROM programmer. His web page on it has a link to http://www.dirtypcbs.com/ with ultra cheap boards. I wonder how their quality is. They have a lot of stock ones too (obviously someone else's custom boards), and a few are quite interesting, including:

• this SMT-to-DIP adapter set
• this board and this board to drive a parallel-interface intelligent LCD module with 65c22 serial (using a 74HC595 shift register)
• this board to drive a parallel-interface intelligent LCD module from I²C, using the MCP23017 I²C port expander
• this C64 expansion port adapter
• this TQFP44-to-DIP adapter
• this LQFP48-to-DIP adapter
• this SSOP24-to-DIP (skinny) adapter

It looks like they hold the price down ultra low in hopes of selling more of your custom board to others who might decide it suits their need too. It would probably be good to do a point-to-point and dimensional check on them before using them, in case the originator had an error that the board house doesn't know about. They take a long time, don't read readme files, have exacting requirements for file extensions, don't allow holes under .012", and are not nice about helping you through problems (because they're not making enough money to give it any human attention) (I can't imagine this one worked out very well), but if you can put up with all that, you get a really inexpensive board, as little as $14 for 10 smallish 2-layer boards. They also offer 4-, 6-, and 8-layer boards.

I've used dirtypcbs a few times -- my 1MB SRAM board was made by them. There boards are very good. I've not had any issues.

[Aslak3]

Aslak3 wrote:

I've used Botechcircuis (http://www.botechcircuits.com/). .... 4 layer boards (which I've not used myself) are $89 at the same size. ...

Have had a 4 layer board made up, and it is a beastie.

Size:264mm x 194mm
4 layer, FR4, 1.6mm
1oz copper thickness
Green soldermask
White silkscreen

It was a entirely throughhole board, with probably the best part of 1000 holes. For 5 pcs it was $200, with $27 DHL. So yeah, not your typical hobby-board. They do look amazing though. Hopefully the next board I have made up will be smaller!