So long, and thanks for all the fish.

kc5tja · Post by **kc5tja** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:55 pm

As people know all too frequently, I have serious problems relating to others here on the forum. While folks rarely have issues with my technical knowledge, how I express that knowledge or engage in discussions can come across as quite acidic, where no corrosion was intended. Consequently, I've decided to take my leave of this forum, and of the 6502/65816 community en toto. This has two benefits: you don't need to deal with me anymore, and I'm free to concentrate my efforts on development of and programming for stack-based CPU architectures.

Much of my consternation comes in the obvious lack of reading comprehension on all parties involved, myself included. English proves utterly unsuitable for discussion of technical topics because of its interpretability. It would be my greatest wish that I never speak English ever again. I hate it; detest it, even. Yet, it's the only spoken language I know. Moreover, it's the only spoken language I know of with the precision necessary to discuss technical topics at all. Romance languages, I understand from native speakers, are much worse, often resorting to importing English words.[1]

I recently got somewhat perturbed at Jesari for, in effect, kind of hijacking a thread I started on why I prefer the 65xx architecture over the AVR. This was wrong of me, and I sincerely apologize, especially when I, quite hypocritically, complain to others who stick so steadfastly to the original purpose of a thread. It's just wrong, and I'm not proud of myself for having done so.[2]

So, with that, I now declare that I have no immediate plans to return. You'll be free of my frustrations, and I'll be free to persue my pet projects in relative, and safe, isolation. Socially, this is of course backwards and potentially inbred, but it seems to me the only way to inflict as little stress on my fellow readers as possible. As a result, I will divest myself of the following projects, en toto:

* 65SIB
* 65Org32 Instruction Set Architecture
* Kestrel (personal 65816-based home computer)

Those whom I feel comfortable conversing with already have my e-mail address. If anyone wishes to contact me but does not have it, please either ask or Google for my blog. You'll stumble upon it eventually.

So long, and thanks for all the fish.

_______________________

1. Ideally, I would prefer Lojban, a language based on predicate logic and thus fully unambiguous enough to support truly technical discussions, but only a handful of fluent speakers exist on the planet. If you thought nobody spoke Esperanto, you should see how few speak Lojban.

2. The point I was trying to make was that a stack-based code generator can exploit the 6502/65816's architectural features, creating code which can be compared to hand-written code favorably and without too much complexity. Further, it requires only a single pass. Not a small feat! However, I used the AVR in comparison, which using the same laws of transformation, produced sub-optimal code.

I know it's sub-optimal. That wasn't the point.

But how do I express this point both compactly and clearly? It doesn't matter; it would have been misinterpreted anyway. It's written in English, I'm a poor communicator, and I get flustered when people don't read what I write as I intend the words to be meant; a most deadly combination.

BigEd · Post by **BigEd** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:15 pm

Samuel
It would be a shame to lose you, and I hope you reconsider. I hope today is just a bad day (and you can whisk this post into the bitbucket). Again, I apologise for the forthright nature of my PM: this is not the outcome I was seeking. I mention it here so no-one else feels responsibility for pushing you away.

sincerely
Ed

ElEctric_EyE · Post by **ElEctric_EyE** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:32 pm

I've seen "flaming" on other forums, and what you do kc5tja is not flaming. You are just very passionate about what you believe. I think there's nothing wrong with that, personally. As the professional you are, your knowledge exceeds that of alot of others in certain areas. Your passion for the 65xx family shows.

Don't beat yourself up over this! Would be sad to lose your input. Let others say what they will, they always will anyway!

jesari · Post by **jesari** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 8:03 pm

I should apologize for my latest posts. It wasn't my intention to hurt anybody. I though of this forum as a place to freely express opinions, ask questions, to expose our ignorance (something I did more tan once) and deal with criticism. At the end it seems I have started another CISC vs RISC holly war.

fachat · Post by **fachat** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 8:27 pm

kc5tja, I am sorry to hear that. You have been a great contributor and I very much value your opinion. I would welcome you back if you'd decide to come back

André

Nightmaretony · Post by **Nightmaretony** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:14 am

Going to be sorry to see you go, man. I still remember when you brought over your KIM1 which I repaired. You are always good people in my book. Don't be a stranger.

BigDumbDinosaur · Post by **BigDumbDinosaur** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:37 am

kc5tja wrote:

...Consequently, I've decided to take my leave of this forum, and of the 6502/65816 community en toto.

You never did strike me as a quitter. Why are you quitting over some minor communications issues?

Quote:

As a result, I will divest myself of the following projects...

You're going to throw away all that time? How about if you rethink all that. Don't be a quitter. This forum needs all the expert input it can get.

GARTHWILSON · Post by **GARTHWILSON** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:50 am

So there you have it. The consensus is that you stay!

ChuckT · Post by **ChuckT** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 10:28 pm

I'll google you. I respect your decision but hoped you would stay.

I've been censored on enough boards and my philosophy about the truth is not to give people what they want but to give people what they need to hear.

jesari · Post by **jesari** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 2:56 pm

ChuckT wrote:

I've been censored on enough boards and my philosophy about the truth is not to give people what they want but to give people what they need to hear.

So, to have a discussion about a topic is censorship... To answer a post with a different opinion is hijacking... This looks like religion and I had enough when I was a boy in a country ruled by priests. But don't worry, I won't disturb this forum again.

Farewell

BigEd · Post by **BigEd** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 3:15 pm

jesari wrote:

ChuckT wrote:

I've been censored on enough boards and my philosophy about the truth is not to give people what they want but to give people what they need to hear.

So, to have a discussion about a topic is censorship... To answer a post with a different opinion is hijacking... This looks like religion and I had enough when I was a boy in a country ruled by priests. But don't worry, I won't disturb this forum again.

Farewell

No, no, no Jesari - this was never about the discussion you had with Samuel. It was about any negative affect his phrasing might have had on you (and many others.) It's up to you to choose not to take ChuckT's comments to heart, or at least to choose not to react. He has no more right to discourage you from participating than I had to discourage Samuel.

Respect and civility and gentle teaching is what's needed here, not bluster and conflict.

Nobody censored Samuel - I did speak to him privately, and he chose to react as he did, which is regrettable. He could equally well have ignored me, because I have no particular rights on the forum.

Can we please all just try to get along?

ElEctric_EyE · Post by **ElEctric_EyE** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:39 am

@ jesari
..."anti-priest", "holly war"...?!

This forum appears to honor everyone's FREEDOM of speech, just look how I go on and on... Let the quitter's quit then.

... Too bad, because your circuit for an SDCARD, in the Hardware section, shows alot of intelligence!

ChuckT · Post by **ChuckT** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:26 am

jesari wrote:

ChuckT wrote:

I've been censored on enough boards and my philosophy about the truth is not to give people what they want but to give people what they need to hear.

So, to have a discussion about a topic is censorship... To answer a post with a different opinion is hijacking... This looks like religion and I had enough when I was a boy in a country ruled by priests. But don't worry, I won't disturb this forum again.

Farewell

I haven't been watching every message nor do I know why everything went down the way it did. I don't really want to know.

I've been kicked off a lot of forums for telling the truth because people don't want to hear the truth or have people speak their mind.

It is a problem for the speaker and the listener.

My advice is this. Everyone is sharing what they are building. When they share what they are building it makes it personal. I think the topic AVR and the 65816 is a topic that invites debate. When people are involved in their projects it makes it personal and when it is coupled with a debate then there is always a possibility that someone's feelings will get hurt and therefore the solution is to say, "I can't discuss this because you are making it personal". People are identifying themselves too much with their work. Another thing is that people don't like to be wrong or embarrassed online. All people are worthy of dignity and respect.

I'm not taking sides at all.

Nightmaretony · Post by **Nightmaretony** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:43 am

Both of you have much to offer here which is why it hurts to seee you both leave. Hope you both can stay.

ChuckT · Post by **ChuckT** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:57 pm

Nightmaretony wrote:

Both of you have much to offer here which is why it hurts to seee you both leave. Hope you both can stay.

"Whoever wins we lose" Predator vs Alien

So long, and thanks for all the fish.

So long, and thanks for all the fish.

Re: So long, and thanks for all the fish.