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Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:00 pm
by enso
Here is a close-up of a failed board with a little resistor for scale. You can see the power distribution buses under the mask, and get a sense of the vias. Note that on my board I did not need that many IOs - I connected an SRAM and every pad of the 6502, a 44-pin connector (a few pins for power) and two 'butterfly' connectors with 4 extra IOs, and have a dozen spares connected to tiny pads. All using the top layer. Only a few special connections (JTAG, power, clocking, configuration) are routed to the bottom.
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:09 pm
by ElEctric_EyE
So oshpark's via's look like they do have soldermask over them?
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:13 pm
by enso
So oshpark's via's look like they do have soldermask over them?
You could do mask or no mask, it's up to your CAD package. The post sockets in the upper left are just big vias.
EDIT: I think they call them 'tented' vias if they have a mask.
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:18 pm
by ElEctric_EyE
Oh OK. BTW ExpressPCB is very competitive. Their 4 layer ProtoPro board service for a 21sqin board is $195. You get 4 boards. Their via's are not soldermasked. You do have to use their free software though. I like it and have grown used to using it.
EDIT: Permit me to show off my
video board to show their quality. I should have added it to the thread a long time ago. It's at the very bottom of the first post.
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:45 pm
by enso
Slighltly OT: Can Express PCB do unplated holes with pads on either side?
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:55 pm
by ElEctric_EyE
Unsure what you mean. Can you draw a pic or something?
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:22 pm
by enso
Unsure what you mean. Can you draw a pic or something?
I mean just a drill hit, without plating. This would have to be a second drilling pass after the plating process is done, and Oshpark's fab does not do it.
I happen to need drill hits piercing pads on top and bottom, without electrically connecting them.
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:27 pm
by ElEctric_EyE
Ah. No, ExpressPCB doesn't have provisions for this either in the board layout program.
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:27 pm
by Arlet
I mean just a drill hit, without plating.
Also known as NPTH, Non-Plated Through Hole.
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:44 pm
by ElEctric_EyE
Back to BGA mounting, in an oven. It's not possible to mount devices simultaneously to the top and bottom of the board is it?
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:56 pm
by Arlet
Back to BGA mounting, in an oven. It's not possible to mount devices simultaneously to the top and bottom of the board is it?
Not simultaneously, but you can mount one side first, reflow it, and then do the other side. Unless components are really heavy, they'll keep hanging on the bottom while the solder melts. I've even done it with fairly big inductors and 1812 ceramic caps.
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:57 pm
by enso
Back to BGA mounting, in an oven. It's not possible to mount devices simultaneously to the top and bottom of the board is it?
Quite the opposite, in an oven it is possible. On a hotplate, you really can't. However, I was considering mounting BGAs and top-layer devices on a hotplate (just because I am so happy with the results), then flipping the board over, applying paste and bottom layer and sticking into the oven for the bottom layer.
I would have to use a special jig to make sure that the top components don't touch the rack, but that's not too hard.
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:58 pm
by ElEctric_EyE
How do you keep the parts from falling off, when you reflow for the opposite side?
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 4:03 pm
by Arlet
How do you keep the parts from falling off, when you reflow for the opposite side?
Surface tension keeps them on. Sometimes they slide around a bit, but BGAs have so many balls that I don't expect a problem there.
Re: Working with Xilinx BGA packages
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 4:05 pm
by enso
How do you keep the parts from falling off, when you reflow for the opposite side?
Like Arlet says, surface tension. And being very, very gentle.
My oven, a convection toaster oven, has a nasty vibrating fan. I really have to rewire and PID it soon.
Of course, the easiest thing to do is place components on top only.