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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 1:01 pm 
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BigEd wrote:
The rest of Jeff's sentence should help you. Without wishing to discourage you, it does appear that you need to read more carefully and think more deeply: this is not easy stuff, it requires study and consideration. What you're aiming to do is build up a mental model of the cycle by cycle behaviour of an MPU in its system, so you know what's happening. This isn't going to work if you just jump from one guess to another: the questions are harder than you think.

What's more, you risk running everyone out of patience: there are half a dozen people here with enough goodwill to help you, but unfortunately that's not an unlimited resource.

Here's what Jeff said. Get paper and pencil and work through cycle by cycle what happens when an MPU reads an instruction. This is going to take you at least a couple of hours.
Dr Jefyll wrote:
BTW in case anyone's wondering, in this thread the term NOP doesn't necessarily imply $EA, the official NOP. $EA isn't ideal for the job of manipulating the '816 to read (but ignore) a series of bytes at PC because it only accesses one byte every 2 cycles. A better choice is to feed the '816 WDM ($42) -- a two-byte NOP that executes in 2 cycles.

I did, and I do (understand, that is). I'm just asking for a simple clarification - the object of the term "feed." Simply put, do you "feed" it on the 'c816 side, in which case that would mean simply running no-op or the WDM instruction, until the co-processor sends back some signal, like an interrupt (stalling the processor from the inside)? Or, is there some external mechanism by which the co-processor sends the $EA or WDM to the 'c816 to execute, stalling the 'c816 externally? Or, if either of those are the case, and what you need is to stall the processor, could one not just hold RDY and (maybe) BE low until the co-processor is ready to return data?

Ed, your suggestion that these are frivolous questions is spurious. If one carefully reads beyond the superficial, one will see that these are actually very pointed questions that just need a little closer read. But, maybe I assume too much, and I should provide further qualification. And, I do appreciate the help. If I need to be more clear, just say that.

Jon

Edit: your previous post would make Socrates blush :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:15 pm 
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(Just to clarify, I wouldn't have said your questions were frivolous. To me that would mean you were not seriously interested in the answers. The problem here, I think, is in underestimating the difficulty of the question. Another way of looking at it, is that I'm saying you need to walk before you can run.)


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:22 pm 
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BigEd wrote:
(Just to clarify, I wouldn't have said your questions were frivolous. To me that would mean you were not seriously interested in the answers. The problem here, I think, is in underestimating the difficulty of the question. Another way of looking at it, is that I'm saying you need to walk before you can run.)

Fair point.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 3:17 pm 
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BigEd wrote:
"sneezes"!!

Gesundheit! That was the politest anthropomorphism I had at hand. I realize that there are many compelling reasons to shoehorn a design that should have 48 pins into a 40-pin DIP, but I hope I can still have a bit of fun at its expense without ruffling too many feathers.

(I don't want to necessarily get labeled as a bully or "forum clown", but I want to keep things light-hearted ... we're all hobbyists, and hobbies should be fun.)

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 3:26 pm 
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barrym95838 wrote:
BigEd wrote:
"sneezes"!!

Gesundheit! That was the politest anthropomorphism I had at hand. I realize that there are many compelling reasons to shoehorn a design that should have 48 pins into a 40-pin DIP, but I hope I can still have a bit of fun at its expense without ruffling too many feathers.

56, optimally, right? Eight more address pins plus an additional eight data pins, for a full 16-bit data bus.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 3:39 pm 
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Jmstein7 wrote:
56, optimally, right? Eight more address pins plus an additional eight data pins, for a full 16-bit data bus.

Be very careful about taking my opinions seriously ... I'm one of those weirdos on the fringe who doesn't even particularly like 8-bit bytes. :)

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 3:42 pm 
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barrym95838 wrote:
Jmstein7 wrote:
56, optimally, right? Eight more address pins plus an additional eight data pins, for a full 16-bit data bus.

Be very careful about taking my opinions seriously ... I'm one of those weirdos on the fringe who doesn't even particularly like 8-bit bytes. :)

Ruh roh! :o

(My best Scooby-Do impression <= Here)


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