I purchased a TI 99/4a 12 years ago because I wanted to see what I missed (namely Parsec). Five years ago I purchased a Co Co 2 to see what a 6809e system and OS-9 was like. Each was less than $100 complete with software and joysticks. I liked the Co Co much more as its design isn't as squirrely as the TI. I also let my kids play with them so they could see what computers used to be like. Right now they're sitting idle on shelf.

But neither of those was a source of nostalgia, as I didn't use them as a teen. No my nostalgia machines are the Apple II and the Atari eight bit line, as my neighbor owned an Apple II and I owned an Atari 400. We wasted a good chunk of our youth playing Star Raiders, Load Runner, and Joust. So I suddenly found myself wanting to buy an Atari eight bit for a nostalgia trip.

I haven't seen any on Craigslist.

On eBay people want $100 to $150 (plus $35 shipping) for a system that they list as untested, or without a power supply. I even wrote one of the sellers asking if they plugged it into a TV, and they wrote back "make me an offer". So I assume they don't work, and most of those auctions end without anyone buying. You'll see a few that state they work for around $200, plus $35 shipping.

I consider myself an expert on vintage computer collecting. I have nearly 80 vintage computers in my collection. OK, some people have much more than me but my passion for them cannot be disputed.

First thing I suggest is to not give up. eBay has been overrun by scalpers that think they can get $18,000 for a stock Apple IIe. That's no joke...I've seen it listed for that amount.

You have to weed through that crap and look at what they actually SELL for. You will find many of them sell for much less.

You mentioned two very popular computers (Apple II and Atari 400). The good thing about being popular is that they made more of them. So they aren't "rare" by any means. Not yet, anyway.

So, if I could offer some advice, it would be:

1) Pick one or the other at first and stick with it. Once you have a good system running, decide if you want to start on the next one. For example, if you pick Atari, then try and grab a few things for it to make it fun to use. Then move on to Apple.

2) If you choose Apple II, don't go for an original Apple II (they SELL for many thousands of $$$). Also, don't go for an Apple II+ (SELL for $300-$800). Instead, get a stock Apple IIe or maybe even an Apple IIc. If you ONLY want to play games, then an Apple IIc is a good option. It takes little space and they sell for about $100 - $140. A little pricey but you won't need much else. Well, other than a TV/monitor. But a good CRT works well with them. IIc's are great little machines but harder to expand. If you want to do any hardware hacking at all, then get an Apple IIe for around $80-$150 or so. Try and get a bundle that comes with at least one floppy drive. The Apple IIe is one of the most versatile machines ever made and the hardware community for it is still thriving. Also, if you get an IIe, make sure it has the SSC (Super Serial Card), disk controller and 80 column card. 90% of IIe's sold have those cards inside. I would be surprised if they were missing. Even if they are, they are cheap to buy. The IIc has them built in (virtually). But you will need them for the IIe. Again, they were VERY common and most of the time, they are still in the IIe when sold. After you get an Apple IIe or IIc, either buy a null modem cable or make your own so that you can use ADT Pro to transfer files over. Or, better yet, get the FloppyEmu from BMOW (Google it). It's about $100 or so but allows you to transfer files from SD card to your IIe/IIc.

Now, there's also the Apple IIgs which is a great machine. And, the eBay scalpers haven't latched on to it as much. But the IIgs might not get you that "nostalgic" feeling you're looking for. Some people claim that the IIgs feels more like a Mac than an IIe and I would agree with that. While it can boot to A2 mode, the detachable keyboard still makes it feel like a Mac. That's not a bad thing. It's just different. Another issue with the IIgs is that you really need to use the Apple monitor that came with it. Which is heavy and adds to the cost. You can use a CRT but it doesn't always look great. So the IIgs is another league, IMHO. Great machine. But different.

3) If you choose an Atari, I would go with the 800 XL. It was Atari's most popular 8-bit computer and they can be purchased for well under $100 if you keep looking. A classic 800 (non-XL) is also great but a little more pricey at around $100-$120 depending on options. The 400 can get a little expensive for some weird reason. The 400 is a great little machine but not recommended for typing. The 800 XL is your best option. Once you get that, look into the SD card or multi-cart options. There are plenty. In fact, the Atari route might be a little cheaper in the long run because they are physically smaller (shipping is less) and they aren't as popular in the "retro collecting community". People are snagging up Apple's at the moment so demand is up for them.

The Atari 8-bit line of computers was really the underdog in the 8-bit world. It had some popularity but nothing like the Apple IIe or Commodore 64.


Now, on your TI....you're right. You'll never get that nostalgic feeling from it if you never used it. But that doesn't mean it can't be fun. It was my very first computer so I have strong nostalgic feeling for it. The great thing about the TI is that it is EXTREMELY active these days! Seriously. It's more active in 2017/2018 than it ever was in the 80's. There are new games and hardware coming out for it all the time.

If you really want to get some miles out of the TI, there are a few things you can do that really makes it (more) fun. First would be get the 32K side-car expansion. All of the new stuff assumes 32K. I forget the exact name of that card but it's pretty cheap to get (even open source if you want to build it). Just go to the Atariage forums and look for TI.

Second would be the SD cart for it. There are a few options for that now. Which allows you to load software from an SD card. It's also pretty cheap.

Finally, if you have a little money to spare, try and get the F18A replacement chip for it. The F18A is a 100% cycle accurate replacement for the TI's video chip (the TMS9918). This chips allows you to connect to a VGA monitor and it looks AMAZING. Plus, it adds some additional features like more sprites, blitter and smooth scrolling. There are new games coming out that use the new features. This option is a little pricey at around $90. And, you will have to do a little surgery to your TI. But it's not hard. No soldering involved (TI socketed the TMS9918). But you will have to run a cable out the back. There are also people that will do it for you.

Now, the CoCo2. I own several CoCo computers (version 2 and 3). I have to admit, I'm not very active with them. I never had them as a kid (my cousin did). Also, the community seems a little less active with them. Not sure why. It's a platform I'd like to get into one day. But I can't offer much advice on it now.

After all of this, if you still want to get into collecting, my next recommendation would be the mighty Commodore 64. By all means, go for Atari and/or Apple II first. For that nostalgia. Then, if you're interested, try your hands at the C64. Nothing beats it for games.

Sorry for the long winded response. But like I said, I'm very passionate about these machines. Let me know if you need any more advice.

Let us know what you decide!

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Cat; the other white meat.

PS...

I forgot to mention. When it comes to repairing these machines, it's rare they cannot be fixed. Unless they are literally busted, broken or damaged. Many times chips can be replaced, drives cleaned, etc.

Most eBay sellers list them as "for parts or repair" because they don't want to guarantee a vintage computer. The good ones will try and boot it up or take lots of pictures.

And, there are countless people (including myself) that can fix these things for you in many cases.

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Cat; the other white meat.

I plan to purchase an Atari, so thanks for the price point observations. After I get one I plan to buy an SIO2SD rather than deal with the old 1050 drives. I've been watching auctions for a week, and noticed the following:

* The 800 XL is the most common, the 400 is next, then the classic 800, with the XE models trailing in the fewest numbers.

* The 400's do seem to be commanding higher prices. That's odd considering it was the cheapest Atari in its day.

* It's good to hear the machines are relatively easy to fix if they're not trashed, so I may keep this in mind.

It may take a few weeks to get a handle on this because so many auctions are listed with a high price and ending unsold.

It might be that specialist forums, like AtariAge for Atari, will give you access to a more sympathetic market of buyers and sellers. It works for Acorn kit on StarDot.

I forgot to mention the XE series. I have the XEGS and a 130XE. I must admit, I strongly advise against the XEGS. Unless you can find it dirt cheap and don't mind it's little quirks. For one, that aweful keyboard is almost as bad as the 400. It tried to be a computer and a console and wasn't great at either. While there is nothing technically wrong with it (other than that mushy keyboard), I still don't recommend them.

The 130XE is technically the most advanced 8-bit Atari with 128K of RAM. It's a very nice machine but will cost more. And there is very little that will support the extra memory. Plus, it also has that awful mushy keyboard. It was clearly made to meet a price point.

One other is the Atari 1200XL. I have one of those and I've never been able to use it. It's a beautiful machine. With a great keyboard. But there are a few issues with it too. One, the keyboard membrane fails on those machines very frequently (mine has failed). Second, it doesn't have the newer GTIA chip that the 800XL has (IIRC, I could be wrong on that one). Also, I think they are a little more pricey too. Again, the 800XL is your best bet.

Shoot...there's another. The 600XL. The 600XL might be a good option too. It's basically a 800XL with half the memory. There are many mods you can do to boost it to the full 64K. But I wouldn't go that route unless you can get the 600XL for a LOT less money.



Yep. And sometimes you will see them show up with an upgraded keyboard. Might as well just get an 800 if you want that style (and 4 joysticks). I think what is happening is collectors like me are looking for machine they don't have. And since the 400's weren't as popular as the 800/800XL's, there were fewer of them. Supply and demand.




Yeah. The thing you have to be careful of, however, is that eBay is also full of poachers. People buying vintage computers and gutting them to make more than it's worth. That's why you see SID chips or POKEY chips for almost as much as a replacement computer. So keep that in mind. Might not be a bad idea down the road to buy another complete computer for parts. Or maybe one that is "for parts or repair". I have several copies of many of my computers for that very reason.






Yeah. It's a damn shame is what it is. Because other eBay sellers who have no idea what something is worth look at those asking prices and think they can get the same price. Instead of looking at the sold price and doing a comparison.

I mean, an Apple II with original sales receipt and ventless case can sell for over $10-$15K or more. But a stock IIe is worth around $75 - $100 without a floppy. But unless you know the difference, you will think "WOW! I have an 'Apple IIe'! I have a small fortune!".





That's another good option. Forums are a great place to find stuff. Many of them even have a "Marketplace" for such sales.

You might want to ask around where you work too. I was recently given a Macintosh LC with original monitor and Apple Laser printer for nothing. The lady knew I collected them and when I showed her a selling price on eBay for less than $20, she realized that the $6000 she paid for it is gone.

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Cat; the other white meat.

@cbmeeks: Last time I checked, "your" Franklin Ace 2200 is still waiting for you at my parents' apartment in Atlanta, boxed up in roughly "C-" condition, with some documentation and software thrown in.

Mike B.

Oh my. I'm sorry. I called a while back because I had forgotten it was down there. Work life got in the way and I've forgotten again. I'm having a hard time getting down to Atlanta at the moment but I should have at least told you/them. So sorry about that. We're on 6 day work weeks at the moment.

I will do my best to rectify the inconvenience. I'm not normally this forgetful.

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Cat; the other white meat.

I'm not an Atari person but what about an Atari XE? On ebay (just checked) prices seem to be low and there is some support for upgrading the cpu to a 65816. See here: http://drac030.krap.pl/en-specyfikacja.php and here: https://www.lotharek.pl/productdetail.php?id=122

Cheers!
Andy

I've always wondered if it would be worth going by the recycling yard occasionally (at least in Germany) -- while getting rid of various stuff (mostly stupid energy saving light bulbs, now almost all replaced by LEDs), I've noticed our local dump has containers full of old computer hardware. Yes, most of that is going to be old 286 office computers and whatnot, but I'm positive that sometimes, somebody doesn't know what they've got in their attic and throws away a (say) nice Atari ST or VIC-20 ...

That's how I came by my two C64s. I found them at the recycling center, along with a tape drive and a power wedge. They've since developed problems. One doesn't start at all; I think it has a failed ram chip, and the video out of the other has gone weird and unreadable.

I "rescued" a Sega Genesis that way once. Then I later found out we're no longer allowed to take anything from the bins. We can't even purchase any of it. Why? Because of identity theft and "hard drives". Yes, that's right....EVERY SINGLE COMPUTER, fax machine, printer and telephone on Earth has a "hard drive" in it that can be used to steal information. At least that's what the 65 year old recycle center manager thinks.

No amount of explanation could convince him otherwise.

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Cat; the other white meat.

Equifax solved the identify theft problem from old hard drives for us. By releasing everyone's personal information, stealing an old PC hard drive will yield less information than the hackers already have.

A week of data collection yields these prices (includes shipping):


I have a number of actions I'm watching which will finish in a week or so. Hopefully I will be able to fill out the table.

The only one of those I don't own is the 65 XE. No way I'm paying $150 for one. I just can't get past those mushy keys.

I've had a little bit of good luck with "LetGo" app. 99.99999% of the stuff on there (in my area) are typical crap like broken phones, XBox, etc. But recently I landed a Mac 512K (only one Mac was older), 400K floppy, original keyboard and IIc mouse (same design but newer) for $60. Amazing deal.

I also managed to get a Sega Genesis and Model 1 Sega CD for $30. In bad shape but I restored it (then the CD stopped working so I have to fix it again).

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Cat; the other white meat.

Best Electronics sells a keyboard upgrade for the XE's for $30. It's supposed to give them a rock solid keyboard. They also sell a used 130 XE (no box) for $175.00. So that's my worst case scenario since I want to use the machine, not keep it in a box, or put the box in storage.